Death of 4wds ?

Submitted: Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 09:40
ThreadID: 36057 Views:2802 Replies:11 FollowUps:19
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Interesting article from SMH today

The dealers are predicting the rise of fuel prices is leading to reduced 2nd hand prices - however good time for a bargain if you're buying

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Reply By: Member - Scott M (NSW) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 09:42

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 09:42
mind you - none of this surprising
AnswerID: 184771

Reply By: Exploder - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:27

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:27
I haven’t even thought of trading down to a smaller car or engine, F**K em I will make allowances in other places of my life, if it comes to that.

I would rather drive something I like and brings me enjoyment than trade down and drive some heap of chit econobox around.
AnswerID: 184779

Follow Up By: Exploder - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:29

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:29
Oh and I guess people don’t look at the consumption figure for some of the new diesel 4WD’s, decent power and economy.

Cheers.
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FollowupID: 441485

Follow Up By: joc45 - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:36

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:36
What surprises me is with the release of the new VE Holden that there is no diesel in the engine lineup, esp as they are being cagey about the consumption figures.
Or are they worried about their performance image if there's a diesel?
Gerry
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Follow Up By: Exploder - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 12:15

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 12:15
I am guessing that it is because Holden source most of there engine parts from GM and I would say GM wouldn’t have a Diesel that could fit into a Commodore and give good drivability.

Ford Aus would be in the same boat.

The coast to develop a diesel engine for the falcon Commodore range would coast too much and not give enough return in sales or profit.

Like who is going to spend an extra 5-10000$ just to drive a diesel commodore or falcon??
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Follow Up By: joc45 - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:16

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:16
Hi Exploder,
Yeh, I hear what you're saying, but both Holden and Ford are going to have to bite the bullet if they're not to become dinosaurs. People in UK/Europe are paying the extra for diesel cars, despite diesel fuel cost being on a par with petrol over there (diesel slightly dearer in UK, slightly cheaper in Eurpope). People here pay the extra for a diesel engine in their 4wd's and they still sell well.
There must surely be suitable or adaptable engines in their global range.
cheers
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FollowupID: 441497

Follow Up By: Member - Axle - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:31

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:31
I see theirs a diesel model in the Holden astra range

Who makes astras , and who manufactures the motors ?,I wouldn"t know, holden seem to be selling a few.

Cheers Axle
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Follow Up By: Member - Leigh (Vic) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 16:34

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 16:34
Got a diesel Astra for evaluation from work at the moment. It is a terrific little vehicle and winds up well at about 2000rpm and just keeps going to 4500rpm, then swaps into next gear and does the same thing another 5 times. About 7 ltrs to 100kms. I'd buy one but then again I am coming off a low base with the troopy.
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Follow Up By: Brett_B - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 17:39

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 17:39
Spoke to a guy from Holden last night,Very interesting bloke, apparently a Diesel VE is being talked about..........

Its talk only though ATM :-O

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Follow Up By: GoneTroppo Member (FNQ) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:05

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:05
Opel had a diesel option in Europe 20 plus years ago. So they are not completely new to it.
GM also built large Diesels under the GM brand. called 'em screemin' jimmies (they were two stroke.) This became Detroit Diesel still around and owned by Daimler Chrysler now.
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Follow Up By: F4Phantom - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:43

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:43
there is an article on the web floating around where holden talks about putting in a BMW diesel or the italian brand VM diesel. If they think they can make cars like the did in the 90's and get away with it, natural selection will have something to say about that, at the moment diesels are all we have to solve some problems. My longer term bet is on plug in hybrid diesels.
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Follow Up By: Off-track - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 19:58

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 19:58
Pretty sure the new Astra is made by Daewoo.

Interesting to know if an option for a diesel falcon/commode will ever happen. Be costly to introduce especially when they can just be chucked on gas like Ford do.
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Follow Up By: Member - Axle - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:42

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:42
Astra made by Daewoo?? MMM. The quality control would want to improve.
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Follow Up By: Member - John G- Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 11:14

Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 11:14
Yeah, give up the coffee and cake for morning tea!! Then the papers and TV news, and then cleanskin reds, and the . . .

The other issue of course is that by the time you add all the bits and pieces that take a manufactured 4WD to a vehicle that suits your purpose, you are finacially committed to the vehicle and the lifestyle.

Safe travelling
John
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FollowupID: 441597

Follow Up By: ringa - Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 17:11

Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 17:11
Hi Folks interesting comments, Re GM & Diesels, dont forget that Gm have a substantial ownership of Isuzu, hence the Rodeo, etc, so they could source a
Commode size engine from them, I suppose
cheers Ringa
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Follow Up By: Flash - Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 23:09

Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 23:09
The Astra is NOT made by Daewoo...far from it. The Astra is German design, built in Belguim, very good quality control.

Sadly though, the new Barina IS Daewoo- not a patch on the previous model....
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 17:46

Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 17:46
Stuff diesel, why didn't they bring it out gas only. That would have been the way to go...
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Follow Up By: F4Phantom - Tuesday, Jul 25, 2006 at 17:34

Tuesday, Jul 25, 2006 at 17:34
gas only solves 1 problem and thats fuel buy price. And it only solves that problem while gas is overly cheap, if it rises at all diesel will win in that one limited area too.
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Reply By: joc45 - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:38

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 11:38
Actually, on the news last night, 4wd sales were up.
Could be something to do with the mining boom, tho.
cheers, Gerry
AnswerID: 184780

Reply By: Mike Harding - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:21

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 13:21
I am reminded of Mark Twain who, when hearing that his obituary had been mistakenly, published by a US newspaper, commented:

"The reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated"
AnswerID: 184788

Reply By: GoneTroppo Member (FNQ) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 17:16

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 17:16
Back at the time of the first fuel crisis in th e'70's when petrol jumped to a ridiculous 28c litre or so (can't remember the actual price) all the media and all the commentators agreed that the spelled the end of V8's and that in 5 years there would not be a single manufacturer offering them.

History shows a different picture.
Hell you can even get one in a Toy not to mention BMW, Benz, Range Rover, Discovery.

Point is the media love making predictions, it sells papers especially if it's gloom and doom.
AnswerID: 184807

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 12:54

Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 12:54
Yep, that's when Holden started to develop the 4-cylinder Commodore.

Then during the Gulf-war in 1991, I paid $1.20 a litre at Rabbit Flat for unleaded - and the bored journalists predicted the death of large engines and 4WDs and the development of green vehicles.

Mike
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Reply By: Member - Stephen M (NSW) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:47

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 18:47
Cant understand why holden has not offered a factory gas set up like the fords??? crazy, our company are all going to fords as on average 5o cents a litre and saving a fortune, untill 2011 that is when the excise will be lifted from the gas then it will be interesting to see what it jumps to, my mate just has his hiace van put on gas was a 3/4 week wait, must be getting popular. Regards Steve M
AnswerID: 184813

Follow Up By: Luke SA - Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 01:12

Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 01:12
Stephen, holden does offer a factory gas i have seen it in a few commodores, VTs-VZ. Not sure if its that holden by design mob that does it or holden but you can order it off the factory floor.

Cheers Luke
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 17:48

Monday, Jul 24, 2006 at 17:48
Yeah my mum has a VT on factory has, it goes awsome, heaps better than the aftermarket gas dunnydores. Almost identical economy to ULP and no loss of power.
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FollowupID: 441803

Reply By: Mikee5 (QLD) - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 19:01

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 19:01
I agree with Gone Troppo. I remember a mate debating whether to buy a new diesel or petrol 40 Series back then. He settled for a petrol on the grounds that petrol would never go over 40cents. That was when GMH dropped the ‘Holden’ and downsized to Commodore for the fuel crisis, this didn’t go down too well, the full sized Falcon of the time was a better seller.
Since then it all settled down and Commodores grew up. V8s came back and Fourbys ruled the world. It would be a brave Australian car maker who moved away from decent sized powerful family cars after what happened last time.
AnswerID: 184816

Reply By: WDR - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:14

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:14
It might become cheaper to buy a "non wreck" and use it for parts - especially given the cost of repairs these days.
AnswerID: 184822

Reply By: RedGibber - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:15

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 20:15
The press (newspapers, TV etc.) will always seek a scapegoat to fill out their "news".

Get a grip guys and gals, the 4WD will never disappear.....it won't, for all the reasons that the press believe it WILL!!!

What we need to be more concernad about is the pressure on 4WD tracks around the country which are being closed for a whole lot of ridiculous reasons...

Cheers
Red
AnswerID: 184823

Reply By: Billowaggi - Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 23:11

Saturday, Jul 22, 2006 at 23:11
Hi all, Ford have access to a ripper v6 diesel out of the Disco3 and Jag vehicles [both brands that Ford own] 140kw / 445nm this engine has been mentioned for fitment in Territory and would go very well in Falcon.
Regards Ken.
AnswerID: 184852

Reply By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 16:34

Sunday, Jul 23, 2006 at 16:34
Title of the thread should read "Death of Mums Taxi"

and we should all be cheering as loud as we can...................
AnswerID: 184909

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